Legion TD main Roles

Hello guys,
this is my first ltd guide and I hope to give you some ideas for team playing...

First of all, imho ltd has 3 roles in a team: incomer, supporter and hard builder.
But what do they do?
Well, an incomer is something that is already explained by HI and some others in the forum, and shall aim for 7/15 till 17 and 7/16 b4 20. He may leak a lot until 23+. He must try to hold as much as possible with low value.

And what are the others 2?
Hard builder is the guy who's in charge of holding leaks from the incomer until 20.
By doing that they must be overvalued and may aim to 7/5~7/7 until 20

And what supporters are? The middle between the two helping the hb to hold the hardest waves such as 14, 17... They may leak sometimes but not too often! Their value should be around the recommended one and they must aim for 7/10-7/12 at lvl 20.

A team to be optimal must be balanced, it means:
4 supporters most pubs
3sup 1 hb against hard incomers and savers
1inc 2 sups 1 hb if you want to play for the long run

I might update the post later on to give some builders idea for each role (like paladins/nature for incomers and order for sups for example)

Hello there Vinaob, I agree with you in most of your aspects, just wanted to add that on games with -gg mode enabled supporters might end with higher lumber/income than the incomer himself.  

Also, the presence of a hardbuilder is debatable. On games with -ns he would not be of much use, he would only hurt the team endgame offense/defensive. Depending on which build/units the supporters/incomer are playing, he is not needed at all and everyone should be able to hit 7/16 before 20~21. Against saving tactics he maybe would be needed, but I guess the best counter to saving tactics is to save as well and hope you're playing a build that is a hard counter to that specific level. Overall, I think building over rec. value is a waste of gold in early/mid levels.

I guess for a team to be successful, players shouldn't "lumber dive" (expression I just come up with) at the same time, but in turns, in a way they don't make themselves vulnerable at the same time. The most common levels to "lumber dive" are between 10 and 11; 14 and 15; 17 and 18. As for early game lumbering, it depends only on what units you're going to play, but I strongly believe that it's very possible to pull high lumbers with minimum leaks with lots of different units combinations. And for regular race play (no -cb), every builder has at least one build that can achieve 7/4 at level 10 with minimum or no leaks.

Best regards NERV.

Hello,

As for incomers, i think i've said enough, so let's talk about "supporters" and "hard builders".

Honestly i don't think that both of those should exist. Reasons to that opinion can look like this:

In Legion Mega you should never sacrifice income on purpose. Even not a tiny bit, where i am talking about "supporters". Because it's more of a countering specific levels, than "overbuilding whatever i have just to hold". There are many examples for this, and I will give u one, for example, your friend has a lot of ranged piercing dmg and you have a slow aura and siege dmg, it is obvious that he will hold 16 and you will hold 17. Also, you didn't mention a King, which is a powerful tool when upgraded (and with heals), he hold a lot on his own too.

So that would be about it, as for income goals that i personally recommend (and if you think it's impossible, i could send you around 100+ replays that proof differently) are next:

1st arena->120-150 income and 7/7-7/8

2nd arena-> 650-800 income and 7/15(16)  

About leaks, it is not important how much you leaked if you manage to make those income scores and if your King is alive at 2nd arena.

Best regards,

HI

Hello,

Well hard builders shouldnt exist i agree they cant help the team in anything.
In the other hand supporters are must since if u have a team only with incomers you will lose at 7,10,14,17 or in best case senario at 20, the king upping and leaking strategy in order to get income failes when more than 2 ppl do it.After all we talk about king not god if all 4 ppl leak at 20 he wont hundle.

Hello,

The problem is that people seem to think that they have to leak if they push income. Which of course, is not true. All depends on your towers and more importantly, on your knowledge. Now let's talk about levels that are expected to leak with high lumberjack upgrades (not counting boss levels since they are too specific):

It actually starts very late, on level 14. And if you have great income, you shouldn't leak (or shouldn't leak much) before 14. Next "leaking" levels are 17 and 20. And that are only 3 hard levels in Legion Mega, with 17 and 20 being much harder than 14. And in new version level 20 is nerfed a bit with unarmored armor type. So 4 heals, fully upgraded King and -ns mode, i'm not losing on 17 or 20.

And then what? Well then you make 700-800 (depending on towers) income on 2nd Arena Fight. That is pretty much game-over since you are not losing the lategame.

So, in my mind there are no any "hard builders" or/and "supporters", there are players that are trying to make maximum possible income (all 4) with the towers they were given while protecting the King as much as possible.

Hello,

Well, first of all it starts on 7 even if you dont realy have that hight income, then if we asume that all 4 players are incomers they will lose at 17-20 for sure, ofc if you leak the hell to get income it wont be realy that worthy but first of all i consider some1 as incomer only if he hits 15-16 lumberjacks till 17(you cant have 0 leaks if you want to get this). Some1 who maxed it at 18-20 is considering supporter if you ask me(and ofc he shouldnt have leaks,or have but few). Also, 700-800 income is much and it cant be achieved with normal builders if you dont want to leak for it,the only builders that can do it are the opest:prophet, hyb, nature, mech, paladin. What you said that most of the times ppl thing they have to leak to get income is wrong isnt exacly truth, as i said leaking all waves for income or leaking almost the entire wave of a hard level is wrong but leaking few creeps for income is fine and some waves are hard anyway, that`s why you need a supporter some1 with both fine income and no leaks, ofc his income will be 400-600 and not more but he can have his 15-16 at arena or even earlier with few leaks, there king will indeed deff wave 20 but if you have only incomers and every1 leak 2-3 then its gg, also 20 isnt the only problem(supporter may leak 20 2) if you want to win the game you have to be ready to def all hard waves(7,10,14,17,20) with enemy sents and specialy agenst savers, personaly i thing the "perfer" 4v4 team would have 2 supporters and 2 incomers, or if u have the op prophet then 3 incomers and 1 supporter would be posible but definatly no 4 incomers. As for what you said that every1 should deff the king trying to have the best income posible, OFC but what if you dont get income units? or what if you picked a bilder who cant go incomer? in that case hitting 700-800 income at second arena is posible so why shouldnt you go for a safer supporter role?